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Hack Chat Transcript, Part 2

A event log for Picking a Laser Hack Chat

The light tool for the job

dan-maloneyDan Maloney 02/22/2023 at 22:060 Comments

charliex1:01 PM
i vent ours outside , since it has a lot of contaminants in it

Thomas Shaddack1:02 PM
Probably with some filler in the rubber.

charliex1:02 PM
co2, fibre, all of them outside you can do it into an active carbon filter as well to help, but its a lot of gas and very small particulate

Thomas Shaddack1:02 PM
would bubbling through water do the job instead of a filter?

Dan Maloney1:03 PM
World's worst hookah

charliex1:04 PM
it'd need a lot of flow, but maybe, waterjets do use the water to help with that too, so its feasible, but there is still the gas depending on what you're cutting

Dan Maloney1:04 PM
Hey @Jonathan Schwartz - we're past an hour now. Want to keep going or wrap it up?

Thomas Shaddack1:05 PM
Aliexpress has some sweet-looking "80 watt" 450nm lasers. How much should I trust the offer? (Assuming incoming power instead of optical.)

Thomas Shaddack1:06 PM
they are reportedly combining power from two diodes.

Thomas Shaddack1:06 PM
it may have multiple chips and beam combining in-module.

Thomas Shaddack1:08 PM
I had good experiences with thin white material cutting when the line was dyed yellow.

Jonathan1:08 PM
Thank you!

charliex1:08 PM
makes a lot more sense when you're watching the youtube too heh

Thomas Shaddack1:08 PM
another trick, engraving polyolefins. paint the engraving areas (text) with a black pen, then scan with defocused blue laser.

Thomas Shaddack1:08 PM
translucent material ignores the beam, paint heats and bakes into surface.

Thomas Shaddack1:09 PM
TRICKS! Do tell do tell do tell!!!

Thomas Shaddack1:09 PM
the trick was to make sure text on polypropylene bottles of solvents won't wash off.

Thomas Shaddack1:11 PM
Any interesting fails? My one was trying to use nascent iodine generated from laser decomposition of iodoform, to etch copper on circuitboards. The copper totally ignored the process and everything stank like an old hospital for DAYS.

charliex1:12 PM
colour is interesting, we managed once to make repeatable colour with our mopa but never again.

Thomas Shaddack1:13 PM
logical. focal point on surface vs in the middle of the material thickness.

charliex1:13 PM
its very sensitive to temperature

Thomas Shaddack1:13 PM
thought. selective surface melting. coat a surface with a powder, eg. plastic or solder, and then raster/trace over.

charliex1:13 PM
which is a big issue with fibres and metal, the work area heats up and changes the cut properties. so much easier with co2 wood/plastic

Thomas Shaddack1:14 PM
then brush off the unmelted powder.

Thomas Shaddack1:17 PM
you can also engrave atypical stuff. I had success with sugar candy.

charliex1:18 PM

charliex1:18 PM
i like making keychains :)

Thomas Shaddack1:18 PM
what about a 5-axis head for the laser? engraving non-flat objects?

charliex1:19 PM
carbon steel

charliex1:19 PM
yes

charliex1:19 PM
3/16th

charliex1:19 PM
in the garage

charliex1:19 PM
LA

charliex1:19 PM
sure , i'm in northridge

Nicolas Tremblay left  the room.1:19 PM

Thomas Shaddack1:19 PM
that's a SWEET machine!

Thomas Shaddack1:20 PM

https://www.improwis.com/projects/food_LaserEngravedCandy/

IMPROWIS

Laser engraved candy

Because, why not? Does everything need a justification? This was the inspiration: Bittersweets, the despair.com Valentine candies A 40W CO2 K40-III laser cutter was employed. A test image ("test" text) was used for the engraving. The candy used are the kind consisting of pressed sugar, with some added starch, citric acid, flavorings and dyes.

Read this on Improwis

charliex1:21 PM
1kW fibre

Thomas Shaddack1:21 PM
could it be done via 3d-scanning the object, then autogenerating the paths of the 5-axis thing to deliver beam perpendicularly to the object where desired?

charliex1:21 PM
sure, we are usually hanging out saturdays and doing stuff

Thomas Shaddack1:22 PM
g-code is the easy part. gcode is nothing but positions of the machine. a bit of math. brain-melting math at times but still just math.

charliex1:22 PM

charliex1:23 PM
you can laser weld too

Thomas Shaddack1:24 PM
3d gcode (and multiaxis) can get crazy. i never got beyond 2.5d yet, and failed to understand CAM software correctly so mostly just generating the toolpaths in python.

charliex1:24 PM
do you mean the 3d capture obama project?

charliex1:24 PM
ahh ok, i meant this one https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-30306967

Thomas Shaddack1:26 PM
femtosecond lasers are fun too. any knowledge of them?

Thomas Shaddack1:26 PM
or the copper-vapor ones?

charliex1:26 PM
would love to get a femtosecond

Thomas Shaddack1:27 PM
short pulsed lasers can vaporize material before the underlying layers can even notice something is happening.

Dan Maloney1:27 PM
@Jonathan Schwartz - thanks so much for your time today, this was really helpful. And thanks to everyone for the great questions!

FYI, I'll post a transcript in a few minutes, along with a link to the YT video. Thanks all!

anfractuosity1:27 PM
thanks a lot!

Inne1:27 PM
Jonathan, I joined late but the info you shared was very useful, I will be rewatching this one.

Thomas Shaddack1:27 PM
also you can cut biomaterials. lasers are used in medicine.

Thomas Shaddack1:27 PM
co2 as a scalpel. got hand in a beam, and it healed nicely.

charliex1:27 PM
so neat

Thomas Shaddack1:28 PM
yup, tattoo removal lasers can be used for welding if the q-switch gets removed.

charliex1:28 PM
cheers

Thomas Shaddack1:28 PM
cheers!!

charliex1:28 PM
yeah ebay cheap tattoo removal lasers :)

charliex1:29 PM
stryropyro style

Thomas Shaddack1:29 PM
lasers don't care what they are used for. if you do not tell the tube it is for medical uses, it will happily deliver its scalpel-cauter like work.

Thomas Shaddack1:29 PM
blue laser works too, though I am a wimp and tried it only on a piece of ham instead of myself. (the CO2 test was accident.)

Thomas Shaddack1:30 PM
...should try melting acrylic powder (eg. the nail-art material) into surface of clear acrylic.

Thomas Shaddack1:31 PM
...or cocoa powder into white chocolate.

charliex1:31 PM
heh

Thomas Shaddack1:31 PM
food shenanigans have the advantage that you can easily dispose of the fails. (and the successes too.)

charliex1:32 PM
i wonder if i can slice pizza

Thomas Shaddack1:32 PM
wisconsin uni tried to cut cheese. turned out you need a uv laser for good cut, without melting more than cutting.

Thomas Shaddack1:33 PM
lasercut pizza will be on youtube. i think i saw it.

charliex1:33 PM
yeah its amazing how many folks think, laser, food lets try it .. our hackerspace had many varied smells

charliex1:33 PM
the fat

Thomas Shaddack1:34 PM
how much cooling does the kilowatt machine need? how big/heavy it is?

charliex1:37 PM
it has a dedicated water color fan thing thats a decent size

charliex1:37 PM
i ahve some pics somewhere i think

Thomas Shaddack1:38 PM
a water chiller?

charliex1:38 PM
https://gweikecnc.com/product/107.html its a gweike, who pretty much supply most everyone these days

charliex1:38 PM
yeah it runs water to the head

charliex1:39 PM

charliex1:40 PM

charliex1:40 PM
and relative size

Thomas Shaddack1:40 PM
sweetie!

charliex1:41 PM
the two tanks were the best we could get on a saturday of n2/o2 persuaded a local brewery supply shop to sell us them, but replaced them with much larger ones

Thomas Shaddack1:41 PM
saw the oxygen separator zeolite beads on aliexpress. for pressure-swing separation.

Thomas Shaddack1:42 PM
could work for both oxygen generation and nitrogen-enriched stream.

charliex1:42 PM
yeah the o2 is very low pressure so that tank we've had since the start, the n2 though you go thru like crazy

Thomas Shaddack1:42 PM
pressurize some air, then cycle compression-decompression through cylinders with the zeolite.

Thomas Shaddack1:43 PM
electrochemical medical oxygen sensors can be bought (annoyingly expensive) too. going up to 100% o2.

charliex1:43 PM
n2 runs about 12 bar

Thomas Shaddack1:43 PM
what is its role in the process? mechanical blowing off stuff from the cut?

charliex1:44 PM
yeah we looked at medical ones, but the pressure and the amount they generate per cost, i think it was about 5K USD for one that makes a very small amount, so going with the rotary compressor with a fridge/dryer setup

charliex1:44 PM
for o2 it helps it burn, the n2 shields

charliex1:44 PM
so deeper cuts/nice cuts

Thomas Shaddack1:44 PM
there are also industrial ones. same principle, bigger size, no medical nonsense paperwork/certs/price.

charliex1:45 PM
yeah iirc the issue was the pressure

Thomas Shaddack1:45 PM
flow speed? as the pressure converts to speed in the nozzle?

charliex1:45 PM
we found a chinese compressor for 4K new that can run upto like 25 bar

Thomas Shaddack1:45 PM
not bad!

charliex1:46 PM
tank pressure, since for the n2 upto a 3mm nozzle with 12 bar

charliex1:46 PM
so a 300 tank lasts maybe 12-15 minutes and thats around what 140 bar?

Thomas Shaddack1:47 PM
there are also membrane-based nitrogen separators.

charliex1:47 PM
yeah we looked at a whole range of medical supply ones, they just didnt generate anywhere near enough for the cost,since medical

Thomas Shaddack1:48 PM
a pair or three medical oxygen generators is sometimes used as alternative to bottled oxygen for smaller-scale glassworking.

charliex1:48 PM
like terra https://www.terrauniversal.com/portable-nitrogen-generator-2700-99.html

Thomas Shaddack1:49 PM
we had a big-ass generator for gas assist in a plastic moulding factory.

charliex1:49 PM
so like 6 scfh

charliex1:50 PM

charliex1:50 PM
yeah this is what we bought

Thomas Shaddack1:50 PM
like with an electric car battery, you could have a nitrogen production unit running 24/7 and feeding a tank and taking out of the tank as needed at higher flow than the generator would give.

charliex1:50 PM
three phase, 15HP, just have to find a place to put it

Thomas Shaddack1:50 PM
a second floor of the garage. :P

Thomas Shaddack1:50 PM
or a basement under the garage.

charliex1:51 PM
i think its going outside in the garden heh, no basements here

Thomas Shaddack1:51 PM
bad geology?

charliex1:52 PM
yeah northridge, earthquakes, liquefaction zone

Thomas Shaddack1:52 PM
yuck.

charliex1:52 PM
yeah you know its bad when you live in a place that has a quake named for it

Thomas Shaddack1:53 PM
fun! get shakin'!

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